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Thread: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

  1. #1
    Young Hero J.L. Carrozza's Avatar
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    Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    List your favorite films by the Godfather of the Kung Fu Flick. Shaw fans seen rather divided between Chang Cheh and Chor Yuen. I personally like them about equally. Chor Yuen's films are better made with better set design, cinemtography and artistry but his Ku Lung movies kind of suffer from these almost comically overcomplicated plots. Chang's films, on the other hand, are more straightforward and entertaining but sort of suffer from an excess of whip zooms and sets that are occasionally on the shoddy side. Still, I love both their films, for entirely different reasons.

    Anyways, my fave Chang films:
    The Blood Brothers
    Vengeance
    The Boxer From Shantung
    Five Shaolin Masters
    The Naval Commandos
    The Water Margin
    The New One Armed Swordsman


    I'm actually not a big fan of Five Venoms, at all. It's kind of, well, a homoerotic kung fu movie.

  2. #2
    It's ALIVE! ALIVE! Arif Khan's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    I've heard some things about Vengeance. Been thinking about getting it.

    Any thoughts?
    Top 5 Directors Of All Time -

    1. Tarantino 2. Argento 3. Miike 4. Bergman 5. Kurosawa

  3. #3
    Registered User John White's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Vengeance is damn, damn good. If you love the Killer, you will see a lot to compare here. I would agree with New One-Armed Swordsman and add Boxer from Shantung as a recommendation.

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    Young Hero J.L. Carrozza's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Yeah, Vengeance is great and, along with The Blood Brothers, one of finest examples of what Chang's movies have to offer.

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    Senior Member Scott Ruhl's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Chinese Super Ninjas, it's the reason I like kung-fu movies.

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    adventures in babysitting Wostry Ferenc's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    I like the one when he is at his gayest!

  7. #7
    Young Hero J.L. Carrozza's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wostry Ferenc
    I like the one when he is at his gayest!
    There's a scene between Ti Lung and David Chiang in The New One Armed Swordsman where I honestly expected the film to turn into a wuxia version of Brokeback Mountain.
    Last edited by J.L. Carrozza; 01-22-2007 at 03:04 PM.

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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    shut up bros it's totally not gay when there's no women and everybody got a shirt off


    anyways, my top 3 chang cheh:
    - vengeance
    - boxer from shantung
    - blood brothers

  9. #9
    Registered User Steve Barr's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wostry Ferenc
    I like the one when he is at his gayest!
    This forum is so slow, why don't you explain your reasoning behind thinking he's homosexual?

    Of the few films of his I've seen, FIVE ELEMENT NINJAS is certainly my favorite.

  10. #10
    Young Hero J.L. Carrozza's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    http://www.sensesofcinema.com/conten.../03/chang.html

    It was something of an open secret that Chang was homosexual, and this knowledge informs his work in an interesting manner

  11. #11
    Wife of Kung Fu Badass
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    "It was something of an open secret that Chang was homosexual, and this knowledge informs his work in an interesting manner."

    Actually, it's nothing of the sort. It's more of an open secret that a couple of his fellow critics (Chang Cheh was considered on of the top Mandarin film critics in the world prior to his success as a writer and director of films), and two of the most powerful, waited years until he was finally down after the failure of his film company in Taiwan to start this rumor, which they propagated throughout his lifetime (and afterwords) in every media they could in an effort to ruin him. Even as he said it was a lie until his dying day. It's little wonder it still continues, as every HK written book on the director's work mentions this story, even his biography! The following is a bit I posted on another forum just a few days ago:

    When he returned to HK after what was considered the failure of his production company, and the venom films didn't do as well as his previous films locally, critics took the chance to turn on Chang in a big way. This is when questions about him being gay turned up, and also complaints about his talent slipping at the box-office and in his films. He was attacked at all angles at this time, so there's little wonder he wouldn't want to go through this period much in his biography. You'll note even in the introduction, there's a mention slipped in about Chang's "gayness," even as Chang takes the time to deny it at least twice in the book to set the record straight. Considering the man was dying as the book was being compiled, I lost of LOT of respect for the HK Film Archives for publishing the comments.

    On a sidenote, this reminds me of a behind the scenes story I heard a little while ago. There's a film called Yang + Ying : Gender In Chinese Cinema that's about gay filmmakers in HK. During this film, there's a segment on Chang Cheh being interviewed by Stanley Kwan. If you've seen the film, you see Chang Cheh sitting in his house talking on camera. During that segment in the film, there's a narrator talking about the clear signs of Chang Cheh's gay films with the typical shots of shirtless fighters, etc. Then they cut to a VERY frail (I'm guessing late 80s) Chang setting in his living room and being asked about being a gay filmmaker. Chang was not told he was being interviewed for a piece on gay films, but on Shaw Brothers films he directed. Chang is asked the question, replies that he was not gay, and simply wanted to put forth strong male role-models on screen during a time where there were none. But Kwan didn't stop there, he continued to ask the same question four more times, in the film it's just once more. On the second question, the old man nearly falls out of his chair and almost starts crying while denying he is gay. In the film, the narriator continues on talking about Chang's "gay" films as if nothing happened. But Kwan continued to ask the question two more times, until Chang brokedown crying saying that such questions were what ruined his career and they were untrue then and now. His wife came in and kicked them out of the house.

    Considering the dozen upon dozens of films NOT made by Chang Cheh in HK that feature shirtless, sweaty males fighting, half the island must have been made up of gay filmmakers in the 70s and 80s!
    Last edited by Linn Haynes; 01-22-2007 at 09:59 PM.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Scott Ruhl's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Man that's fucked-up.

  13. #13
    adventures in babysitting Wostry Ferenc's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Barr
    This forum is so slow, why don't you explain your reasoning behind thinking he's homosexual?
    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    My post was a sort-of-an-inside joke - altough I totally disagree with Linn and do think he was gay as Richard Simmons, even I'm tired of this debate, which we had for years now, and I just wanted to stir shit up.

    There's no fucking way I'm going to start now and go into why I think he was what he was, I did it in the past enough times. And I don't think I have too even: if you've seen a couple of his movies you'll know...

  14. #14
    Young Hero J.L. Carrozza's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    I guess you can't believe everything you read, can you?

    And Wostry, if you can't stand Chang's movies that much, why post in a thread about them?

    Shanghai 13 was a pretty awful, cheapass production saved only by its all star cast, I will say that.

  15. #15
    adventures in babysitting Wostry Ferenc's Avatar
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    Re: Favorite Chang Cheh films?

    Quote Originally Posted by J.L. Carrozza
    And Wostry, if you can't stand Chang's movies that much, why post in a thread about them?
    Where or when did I wrote anything that even resembles what you are accusing me with?

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